In 1947 the UN proposed splitting mandate lands between a Jewish state and a second Arab state. The Arabs refused the plan. 1948 Jordan and Egypt attacked Israel and took parts of the mandate lands. Jordan captured the West Bank, and Egypt Captured Gaza. Jordan, Egypt and Israel all gained territory according to the 1949 armistice line. In 1967 Egypt and Jordan attacked Israel again and lost the West Bank and Gaza to Israel who took control of both. Now where the heck did the Palestinians come from? Israel won a war and took back Jordanian and Egyptian land, not Palestinian. The majority of the folks claiming to be Palestinian are Jordanians and Egyptians who lost their citizenship when those countries cut ties and renounced all claim to the territories in the 1980’s. Why then should Israel magically grant these former Jordanians and Egyptians their own state? It doesn’t make any sense.
http://www.passia.org/palestine_facts/MAPS/1947-un-partition-plan-reso.html
they don't deserve anything Israel won that land fair and square. If the tables were turned and Israel lost do you think they would give Israel any land?
Because of historical reasons.
This map “First Jewish colony in Palestine, 1878†http://www.passia.org/palestine_facts/MAPS/first_zionist_colony.htm
“United Nations Partition Plan-UN Resolution 181, 1947 / Rhodes Armistice Line, 1949†http://www.passia.org/palestine_facts/MAPS/1947-un-partition-plan-reso.html
This offer “Projection of the West Bank Final Status Map presented by Israel, Camp David, July 2000†http://www.passia.org/palestine_facts/MAPS/wbgs_campdavid.html
@ fear: wouldn't the wars post the Balfour Dec trump any language written in it? The Pals are (trying to) engage in another war to take it back. Israel is just defending their lands won in the 60s. The thing with global society now is that it is frowned upon to wage war for land gains. That mindset was thankfully ingrained into the global mind courtesy of Germany's two attempts at word domination.
Well listen genius, the Palestinians deserve that land because they have lived there for thousands of years. Germany was the country that persecuted us not Palestine so let's carve out a spot to make settlements in Germany. The Palestinians gave us a place to stay and in turn we kick them out. Do you think Mexicans should do that to Americans?
The whole land was theirs in the first place. They do not only deserve the west bank, but the whole country itself. Israel is a cruel nation that seeps to levels of ethnic cleansing to get what they want.
they were their way before the European jewish people OK,they got their @ss kick...but even the AMERICAN Indian got some land....and do it for peace sake !!!!! all of the sh!t going on in that part of the world is because of this...
Agree with True Jew - beautiful answer.
Agreed Poncie, and as you no doubt know a significant number of ultra-orthodox Jews are amongst the greatest Jewish champions of justice for Palestinians and are extremely anti-zionist.
Well you know it's always tricky when you create a new country by force. Somebody's bound to be unhappy.
might want to look into the balfour declaration and the rothschils
History
Well, Kin, I think the word "magically" ought to be used a bit more carefully, since the state of Israel came into existence through a UN Resolution in the late 1940's. Ought that to be considered magical as well, since many European and American Jews who subsequently migrated to Israel had no relationship or connection to the region? It's dangerous to throw around words like "deserve"...
But let's leave that aside for a moment. If you accept the legitimacy of that 1947 resolution, then you've answered your own question. For it was that same act of the UN that established the Gaza Strip as a region set aside expressly for the Palestinians. Moreover, as you yourself note, the West Bank was set aside for an Arab state. How do the actions of Jordan and Egypt, who as you point out are not Palestinians, figure into this equation? If they chose not to accept the state of Israel, that has no bearing on Palestinian action, does it? In fact, many Palestinians left the West Bank after 1967 as refugees in a war that they had no control or say over.
If you want to blame other countries for attacking Israel, I think you have a lot of reason for doing so. But if Palestinians are not Egyptians and are not Jordanians, then you need to rethink the nature of the question you are asking and recognize its inherent flaws.
Cheers.
ADDITIONAL NOTE:
I think you are laboring under a couple of misconceptions. First, I did not state that the same resolution established a Palestinian state, but that the mandate for Gaza being set aside for the eventual establishment of a Palestinian state.
Second, I did not suggest that of the West Bank, either. I agreed that it was set aside for the establishment of an Arab state. I did not specify what kind of state. It's true that Jordanians are not Palestinians, but both are Arab.
Third, these territories were absorbed into Egypt and Jordan respectively AFTER the war of 1948, not as a result any UN resolution. The political aftermath of that war, as well as those of '67 and '73, did not make the land acquired by Israel anymore Israel's than it did Egypt or Jordan's in previous wars.
Fourth, your comment that "Israel is not obligated to give away land just because the loser of the war demands it" would apply to Jordan and Egypt, not the Palestinians. Your attempt to blend these distinctions is problematic at best, mendacious at worst.
Fifth, the establishment of Jordan by the British in 1923 has no bearing on the discussion. You were talking about the establishment of a Palestinian state with regards to the establishment of Israel. Moreover, even if I were to accept your reasoning, it has little merit. The numbers of Jews living in what would become Jordan aside, there were also many Palestinians in what would become Israel. Moreover, the period since Israel's founding has seen the mass emigration of Jews in Europe and the Americas to the region, who had no connection to the land at all.
Finally, I would be careful if you wish to argue that "at worst they reverted back to their pre-1948 status as unallocated mandate lands, which were never Palestinian to begin with." One can easily make that comment about Israel pre-1947. You might want to think about this differently.
Cheers.
well, as i understand it 99% of Palestinians could prove title to their homes and land. However Israel regards those who fled in 1948 as having abandoned them, so they were now free to be given to anyone claiming to be a Jew. Have been told that there are teams of researchers who examine every deed to each Arab house in East Jerusalem. if they can find anyone who's ever owned it, even if it was only for a few years back in the 19the century who could be jewish then that property is declared to be a jewish one and action is taken to evict the present day owners. I know its illegal and illogical but legality and logic are not often found with orthodox Jews.
Palestine was not the instigator in those wars. And do you not think that if Jordan, Egypt and Syria took over the entirety of Israel, the US would let that slide? The reason these things happen is that no one is batting for Palestine. We have lumped them together with all of the other "Arab Terrorists". Except the Saudi's. Because they have money and oil. Just like the Allies gave the countries of Europe back after WW2, the Palestinians deserve some sovereignty in their native country. Their people have lived in Israel a lot longer than the European Jews. Might doesn't make right. That would give the US the right to invade all sorts of countries for no reason. Israel is backlashing for their own oppression. Somehow, Israel needs to realize, along with Palestine, that peace and cooperation is needed for their continued survival.
I don't think they understand what is going on, but are merely echoing the anti-Semitic posture of the Obama admin.
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